Let’s not forget celebs are marketers too.
April 17th, 2009 | Author: Beth Harte
Ah, Ashton, Oprah…I should get a publicity fee for talking about you last night on Twitter!
Sorry, dreaming…back to the subject at hand. Last night Jim Turner of BlogWorld made an off the cuff statement about having Oprah keynote this year’s BlogWorld that, as you can image, led to a very interesting conversation (be sure to check out both Twitter Searches). The debate ranges from Oprah isn’t a social media expert to Oprah could drive more social media use and increase BlogWorld sponsorships.
Here are my thoughts on all of it… As social media purists-who believe that social media is actually changing marketing and business as we know it-is it fair to give celebrities (as businesses) a pass because they are famous? Would you give Steve Jobs or Richard Branson or any other business (large, medium or small) a pass? Let’s face facts, some celebs have way more time on their hands to Twitter (insert any other social media tool here) than the average CEO or VP of Marketing and yet the business folks are constantly scrutinized and beat up daily for their social media missteps.
Marketing, pure and simple, is about making people part with their money, right? Whether it’s a business, non-profit, government agency, university/college, etc…they are all trying to get you to dig into your wallets and part with your cash. Celebrities are no different. They don’t act in movies or host TV shows because it’s fun. Nope. They do it to entertain you so you will give them LOTS of your money.
When we discuss this brave new world of social media and marketing, we social media purists advise companies that they need to start conversations with customers, prospective, that they need to become part of the community and more. Celebrities are no different. Yes, I get it, some people on Twitter will never care if Ashton or Oprah talk back (that is if the Oprah account is really hers) or if they have ghost bloggers/tweeters or if they never engage with the community. And yes, celebrities could use social media tools for a one way push of messaging (well, not Ashton so much). I get all of that. But…
What if it were really the celebrities blogging/tweeting, etc.? Wouldn’t they experience as much of a reward from social media that we promise to businesses? i.e. more brand evangelists, more revenues, more dialogue that leads to better product, etc.
What do you think? Should celebs be held to the same level of accountability as businesses?
My vote: Oprah shouldn’t keynote BlogWorld…No, not just yet anyway. Ashton Kutcher, Shaq, MC Hammer…indeed.
[Image: Anovelista.com]
Tags: 40 Responses to “Let’s not forget celebs are marketers too.”
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Beth,
Great post. I find it interesting… this discussion about whether or not to allow celebs to be on Twitter. First, who cares really? If we don’t like what they are doing, the good news is we can tell them straight up. Twitter’ers have never been shy, so why be shy now? We’re just making a stink that they are arriving, but we can’t stop it. It’s a gathering place, and more brands AND celebs will be finding their way here.
I don’t think we should change our expectations of what communications we want from anyone we follow – we prefer transparency not ghost twitterers. So if we feel they are not being transparent, let’s tell them. Let them hear Twitter roar, we’ve done it before. It changes behavior. We’ve seen it over and over.
Look, no one gets a free pass here in social media spheres. The rules are defined by those who participate. Black eyes will be had, it’s something we can all learn from.
And personally, I hope those celebs like @Oprah get on here and actually do something good with it. For charity. And to make themselves accessible. That’s what I like about Ashton Kutcher @aplusk and Shaquille O’Neal, they remain accessible. We may not always like what they have to say, but we have a choice to tune in.
Very much vote in line with you on the BlogWorld keynote. Maybe next year, Oprah doesn’t have her credibility in this world yet. Being Oprah doesn’t count. Her voice is thru TV. Maybe by next year she will. But we both know those decisions get weighed against conference budgets, and what names will get BIS (butts in seats). Let’s hope the don’t cave.
Thanks Beth!
Juliann Grant’s last blog post..Twitter Useage Soars
IMHO, nobody should be able to do anything just because they are famous. And yes, I think Oprah is a very poor choice to keynote BlogWorld. Might Oprah drive folks to social media? Better than average chance. Will they get it? Not likely. That’s because I believe that Oprah’s Midas touch is largely about people blindly trusting her–not about them really understanding what she’s recommending. There are people out there who want to read what she reads and eat what she eats just because she’s Oprah. As my father once said, “If Oprah jumped off a bridge, would you do it?” I believe there are those who would. And they will bring absolutely no value to social media other than their presence.
Art Aiello’s last blog post..I Hate Binders
I just find it curious how we devote so much time trying to expose the ‘charlatans’ that claim social media expertise that we feel they haven’t earned, but then when a celeb starts using Twitter, we fawn over them and start considering offering them keynotes at social media conferences?
I see that as a massive disconnect. What makes Oprah more qualified to speak on social media than the teenager that joined 5 mins ago? Nothing at all.
And BTW, I could care less if Oprah is using Twitter, but at the same time, I have no problem whatsoever with her doing so. But I think it’s beyond silly to start offering her up as a ’social media expert’ and being qualified to keynote at major social media events.
Mack Collier’s last blog post..Better post titles work, and here’s the proof
Interesting conversation.
I see a lot of parallels in how businesses and celebrities use (or should use) social media.
Both use social media to create a “human” interaction with their customers/fans.
Both are being talked about online negatively and positively, and should take part in the conversation.
As you said, both are trying to make money.
At the same time, I feel like businesses have a little more to worry about. Celebrities can be a little more free in what they do and say. People definitely hold businesses more accountable than they do celebrities. When people connect with celebrities online, they don’t look at it as they’re being sold something, although that’s exactly what’s happening. I’m not saying its how it should, it just seems to be how it is.
Dave
David Spinks’s last blog post..Will Google Continue to Be Successful?
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This is a great take Beth and I agree on most of it. Is Oprah going to keynote? I have more of chance to keynote at the White House or being the leading man in the next Angelina Jolie movie.
Who will be keynoting? We are trying very hard to get relevant leaders in out industry. We are also trying to get women speakers, and get diverse speakers and to make everyone happy. Many of the usual suspects want unreachable speaking fees or have turned us down as we are not important enough. We will keep asking. It is obviously going to be difficult. Heck, I can’t even convince Mack that I don’t consider Oprah a social media expert in spite of saying it 100 times.
We do struggle with this and we want to do right by every one. Thanks for keeping us on track. We are listening. What is your suggestions for a keynote speaker? Perhaps we have already asked them and they have turned us down. The may be speaking already and we haven’t settled on a sum. Yes, even the people in our business want to make money.
Jim “Genuine” Turner’s last blog post..A Test For Monetizing Your Blog With Qumana
Hi Beth,
Perhaps I have read your post wrong, in your assessment there is an assumption that Oprah, (or any other person that may be more widely recognized or popular that the typical Social Media Pundits) is conducting themselves as a Social Media Expert
Oprah and Aston did more to spread the word about Social Media in a few hours than the rest of us have done in a few years. Do they have more resources, of course. Is that what upsets folks, that they were able to accomplish more in hours than the erst of us have in years?
What are the requirements to earn your Social Media Stripes, five hours of tweeting or five hundred hours of tweeting or five minutes of tweeting.
And, I would hands down have Oprah Keynote, or whoever I could find that would draw the biggest crowd for the use intended.
I agree with the heart of your post completely Beth. We should hold celebrities to the same standard we do companies or any other individual using new media.
However I don’t see how that point is relevant at all to the discussion we were having the other night.
Twitter is not social media. It is one tool in larger set of tools and in fact a small one when you compare it to blogs (there are hundreds of millions of blogs), or Facebook which just passed the 200 million mark. It is just the latest one with the current hype.
Twitter is great don’t get me wrong but lets keep things in perspective.
Mack keeps raising a straw man argument and there really isn’t anyway to debate it with him when he cant be intellectually honest about it. He is making a claim no one else has made.
As for Oprah or Ashton being more qualified than teenager who joined Twitter 5 minutes ago again its a nonsensical point.
Oprah is the head of a media empire and has had a presence on the web for over a decade including blogs, forums and podcasts. Yes she is a Johnny come lately to Twitter but so are a lot of other folks. So what?
Our event isn’t called TwitterWorld for a reason.
There is a convergence between traditional media and new media. Oprah does play in both worlds. Her views on new media as it relates to traditional media is very relevant to our core audience. The independent new media content creator.
Her continued increasing presence in this space is relevant to every one of us in some form or another. A simple search about Oprah joining Twitter proves my point.
Rick Calvert’s last blog post..Job Seeking? Social Networking Can Help!
“Mack keeps raising a straw man argument and there really isn’t anyway to debate it with him when he cant be intellectually honest about it. He is making a claim no one else has made.”
Rick, you and Jim can say ‘hey we never said Oprah was a social media expert!’ all you want, but that IS the (perhaps unintentional) message you sending by saying you want her to keynote your social media conference. As others have told you, conference attendees expect the keynote presenter to be an expert or someone with much expertise. And I think you know this as well.
As I said on your post Rick, if you had said ‘we’d like to invite Oprah to appear on a panel about celebs using Twitter’, then I doubt anyone would have said a word. In fact that would have been a great idea.
But let’s remember that Jim got excited about the idea of having Oprah keynote BWE as soon as he heard that she had joined Twitter.
Again, I have no problem whatsoever with you wanting to have Oprah keynote your conference. My main point all along has been that you can’t try to position BWE as being a conference about the best in ‘new media’ on one hand, and then on the other offer speaking to people simply because they are celebs, and not because of their qualifications. Doing so might bring more exposure to your show, but it also hurts its credibility and positioning as being about the ‘best’ of new media.
If you are ok with that tradeoff, then knock yourselves out. At the end of the day its your conference, and you have to do what you think is best for it.
Great post & debate. I do agree that celebs are brands & businesses can learn from how they use social media. That’s why we have MC Hammer speaking at TWTRCON on 5/31!
“What if it were really the celebrities blogging/tweeting, etc.? Wouldn’t they experience as much of a reward from social media that we promise to businesses?”
Great point Beth. If you think of it the “stars” I would rave about the most would be the ones that connected with their audience.
Real world example #1: We went to see a taping of Jeopardy during March break this year. During every break in the show Alex T. came out to the audience and interacted. He loved it and so did we. Alex went WAY up in my books after this.
Real world example #2: When driving around Studio City we drove past Billy Ray Cyrus out walking the dogs. I spun around not for the driveby photo shoot but to say hello. Chatted up with Billy Ray for a moment or two and he initiated part of the conversation. Again, he was accessible and connected – lots of respect for him.
So, once some of these TV stars start to understand that Twitter is not a PR “push” medium I think they will potentially reap some of these similar benefits. Yes, they can’t connect with everyone but how about 5-10 a day for starters. What would that take, 10 minutes tops? And think of the buzz it would create.
Interestingly enough the 3 folks you said should be picks over Oprah for speaking at Blogworld actually come close to following these principles.
Fun debate Beth. thx
David
David Alston’s last blog post..Marketers are farmers. Increasing yield is not just buying more land & spreading more seeds.
Isn’t this a bit like saying Oprah shouldn’t be asked to keynote at a Cancer Prevention benefit because she’s not a cancer surgeon?
From what I gather, Jim never said that Oprah was a “social media expert” – simply that he’d love her to keynote.
As another comment has mentioned, she runs a massively successful media empire. Sure, she probably doesn’t have her hand in every creative piece of pie, but I’m pretty sure she’ll control a lot of the branding around that media company.
I’m no huge fan of celebrity fawning – but saying that someone shouldn’t do something because they’re not “an expert” comes across as a little snobbish.
What would happen if Oprah did keynote, and a bunch of people took up blogging because even a “noob” like Oprah shows how easy it is.
Wouldn’t it be more beneficial to have Oprah appear and converse in-depth with the people that have been blogging for years, etc, and get a real understanding of why it’s so popular and what it can achieve?
That would seem a more social media-type of approach than just carpeting someone for the idea in the first place.
Danny Brown’s last blog post..Talking Twitter with CityNews Toronto
Wait — you mean Oprah can’t walk on water?! Huh.
One of the beautiful things about social media is that as a platform (or various platforms) it gives voices to those who otherwise would not be heard (i.e. people who are NOT celebrities), and though social media, those same non-celebrities can become celebrities — (i.e. Gary Vaynerchuck) — at least to those in that “world”.
With Super Celebrities like Oprah suddenly jumping in the social media waters, my question is whether that will suppress the Average Joes who, without the presence of Super Celebrities, would have a much better chance of becoming “big” in the SM world, and thus have a chance of being that keynote speaker at Blogworld or whatever conference happens.
I don’t know, I can’t really answer that, but what I do know is that each has their own following, and some will flock to the Super Celebs with stars in their eyes, and others will remain loyal to Average Joe.
Oprah is really good at one thing — being Oprah. Her influence and Midas touch is something that I admire and respect, but I also don’t read certain books because she told me to, nor would I sign up for a service that she did unless it really interested me and was relevant.
I wrote a tongue-in-cheek post on her joining Twitter and what that might mean, but whether or not she (or another Super Celebrity) will experience as much of a reward as we tell businesses isn’t a fair question to ask. Oprah is the head of a media empire — what else does she really need? People know who she is, what she’s about, etc. . . . other than ego stroking, I don’t think it has much benefit to her at all. Oprah’s name or brand is powerful enough — someone is just as likely (or unlikely) to buy a book because Oprah said so regardless of where they heard it — on her show or on her Twitter feed.
Stacy Lukas’s last blog post..The Tweetoprahcalypse is here.
I would argue that Oprah has been using media (online or otherwise) to communicate with her audience for a heck of a lot longer than these so called “social media experts”. And I don’t think she really gives a rat’s butt about any of this stuff. It’s all media. It’s all effective if used well.
Harpo Productions im sure, is full of smart, educated, ACTUAL experts who know damn well what this stuff is about. That’s why it’s a multimillion dollar company. I think it’s a little presumptuous to think that just because Oprah went on Twitter last week that her and her staff don’t understand what new media is all about.
Sue Murphy’s last blog post..Why It’s All About Stories
Lets try and move the ball forward ok Mack?
Lets start from the premise that you did originally assume Jim and/or I intended to position Oprah as a social media expert.
We have since that time stated several times in multiple formats that we never said it, never intended it and were quite clear about our real intent.
So now you know the real reason we think she would make an interesting speaker. How about responding to that point instead of going around in circles?
As for having speakers that don’t fit your profile as being qualified to speak at BlogWorld I would kindly ask that you take a look at our conference program from last year and tell me where you can find a broader scope of perspectives on new media?
http://bit.ly/k4DAN
Where can you find as diverse of a group of speakers in every aspect? From content niche, to race, to sex, to sexual orientation, to political views, to you name the criteria.
http://bit.ly/MnY00
I am quite confident there is nothing else like our event. I am quite proud of what we have done and what we are yet to do.
One last note I respect you Mack and your point of view. I am trying to have an honest dialog with you and I am asking with all humility that you do the same.
You have several times characterized Jim’s original tweet as “Jim got excited about the idea of having Oprah keynote BWE as soon as he heard that she had joined Twitter”
When you should know that is simply not true and unfair.
I would think that due to your previous conversations with him you would know better than to think of him as some sort of celebrity fanboy.
Rick Calvert’s last blog post..Job Seeking? Social Networking Can Help!
“I think it’s a little presumptuous to think that just because Oprah went on Twitter last week that her and her staff don’t understand what new media is all about.”
Sue if that’s the case, then it flies in the face of all we’ve heard about blogging and social media for the last decade. How often have we told companies that they have to ‘get their hands dirty’ with social media? That they can’t instantly start using these tools and understand why and how they work?
But now that it’s Oprah, we forget all that? If that’s the case, then anyone that reads ProBlogger should be a blogging expert, right?
Sorry but Oprah can be surrounded by all the smart people in the world, and all they can relay is THEIR understanding of how social media works. Until Oprah becomes acclimated to these tools HERSELF, then she won’t understand how and why they work.
First-hand experience still counts, celebrity or not.
Mack Collier’s last blog post..Better post titles work, and here’s the proof
@Mack.
I think what Sue’s probably saying is what many others are saying. Twitter is just one example of social media’s toolset.
Who’s to say Oprah (or any celeb for that matter, but obviously we’re talking about Oprah here) doesn’t know about the tools?
Let’s just say for one minute that she’s taken the advice of social media “experts” and experimented with Twitter, but as an anonymous lurker.
She’s wanted to test the waters but knows her name would attract thousands of eyes from curiosity. So she picks a username and just watches the streams.
She does this for a while and then, when comfortable with the medium, comes on herself. Only when she’s confident that her “brand” won’t be damaged.
Now, I’m not for a minute saying this is what’s happened. But at the same time, a lot of “experts” are advising this as an approach to take. After all, if you’re “not ready” for social media then don’t take it on.
So where is she (or anyone else in the same boat) at fault then?
As far as the comment goes about “all the smart people in the world… relaying THEIR experience” – isn’t this just what social media consultants are offering their clients?
So where’s the difference?
I really don’t see why people are getting all riled about this. It’s becoming akin to kids wanting to control the playground and offers firepower to people that criticize social media as nothing more than a sandpit for the niche members.
Danny Brown’s last blog post..Community Spirit and Blog Comments Redux
I absolutely agree with Mack, and I think it’s more than a little presumptuous to believe that because Oprah is a multimillion dollar media magnate that she understands the nuances of social media.
Art Aiello’s last blog post..I Hate Binders
@Art. By that token, isn’t it “more than a little presumptious” to say that she’s not, without knowledge of her media operations?
Danny Brown’s last blog post..Lazy Sundays – SuzeMuse
@Danny Brown I think it wiser to presume ignorance than to presume knowledge. Just as in a job interview we are not taken at our word, Oprah has to prove herself. Certainly she’s achieved a great deal of success and proven herself capable of a great many things. Is it likely she will get the nuances of social media? Perhaps. But we’ve already seen very capable ad agencies misuse social media. Even very savvy PR firms–for which social media should be a boon–have trouble using it properly. Most of us in this debate likely have challenges with it. My point is very simple: Oprah should not get a pass for being Oprah, in spite of her track record, and she should not be treated preferentially simply because she ostensibly has the power to “mainstream” social media. There are others out there with more knowledge and experience who could share more valuable information to those of us who want to use it as a tool.
Art Aiello’s last blog post..I Hate Binders
@Art. You’re correct, no-one should “get a pass” – but neither should they be denied just because of who they are either.
That just smacks of of control – something that’s the very opposite of what social media is about.
Danny Brown’s last blog post..Lazy Sundays – SuzeMuse
The spin given Oprah on the heels of her first public xxxx… I mean Tweet… is absolutely unbelievable.
~~~ ~~~ ~~~ ~~~ ~~~ ~~~ ~~~
Why doesn’t Oprah just buy Twitter and put an @FREE Twitter account under every guest’s seat.
Hey, even better still.
What does Oprah need BlogWorld for?
Oprah can just start her own ‘O’ – social media conference’ and star in it herself. It’ll likely be bigger than anything else on the docket this year, and even most of the the purists will attend. She could charge 3 times as much and provide loads of celebrities to guest speak.
Why not the ‘O’ – social media network?
AHHHHhhhhh!!
~~~ ~~~ ~~~ ~~~ ~~~ ~~~ ~~~
I’m in a cold sweat and hoping this is only a bad dream. The notion of Oprah keynoting on social media would offend even Eric Cartman.
God, I really hope South Park picks this up! Towely could play Aston @aplusk Kutcher. It would be great.
Excuse me. I’ve got to go and vomit now.
@Danny Brown Absolutely agree with you re: control. But my argument has nothing to do with control. Nobody is shutting her out. I’m only suggesting that she has not yet earned the right to keynote at a social media meeting. Let her Tweet, let her learn, and let her earn that right.
Art Aiello’s last blog post..I Hate Binders
Addressing some comments by Danny:
“Who’s to say Oprah (or any celeb for that matter, but obviously we’re talking about Oprah here) doesn’t know about the tools?
Let’s just say for one minute that she’s taken the advice of social media “experts” and experimented with Twitter, but as an anonymous lurker.”
Good point, Danny. Now, have you heard/read anything to suggest that this has happened? If not, I don’t think it’s too ‘out there’ to assume that she’s probably pretty new to using social media.
“As far as the comment goes about “all the smart people in the world… relaying THEIR experience” – isn’t this just what social media consultants are offering their clients?
So where’s the difference?”
The difference is, most capable social media consultants are TEACHING their clients how to show social media, not simply sharing their experiences. I could tell Oprah all day for a month how I use social media successfully. And it would probably help her a bit, but she wouldn’t learn what social media is REALLY all about until she used the tools for herself.
If I were hired by Oprah to help her understand social media, I would have her start using the tools ASAP. I would have her be herself, and be honest that she is learning as she goes.
“I really don’t see why people are getting all riled about this. It’s becoming akin to kids wanting to control the playground and offers firepower to people that criticize social media as nothing more than a sandpit for the niche members.”
People are getting upset, because Oprah is being offered a position that her only ‘qualification’ for, is that she’s a celebrity. It’s a dangerous path to start down, because if BWE let’s Oprah keynote, then the next show will have whatever celeb that joined 5 days previous be their keynote.
And this matters because as more ‘Johnny come lately’ celebs are added to speak on how to use social media effectively, the people that ACTUALLY understand how to use social media, people like you, like Beth Harte, like Shannon Paul, like Chris Brogan, THEY will be bumped from speaking, to make way for Jay Leno, Britney Spears and 50 Cent.
And I’ll repeat once again; I have NO problem with Oprah being on Twitter, and have NO problem with her speaking at BWE, given that she can speak on something she knows about, such as how to use Twitter as a celebrity.
But is she qualified to speak as an authority on social media? Of course not. And yes, I understand that her fans would argue otherwise, but I’m sorry, she is NOT a social media expert, and we devalue the entire space if we make a special exception to claim that she is.
Mack Collier’s last blog post..Better post titles work, and here’s the proof
Perhaps I’m a bit jaded, or just feeling cranky (it is Monday after all), but I fail to see the point of this debate. Oprah is on Twitter. So is Ashton Kutcher. So are a bunch of other celebs that are using Twitter as a broadcasting mechanism and not as a way to initiate conversations with like-minded individuals.
If it is their choice to join Twitter and do that why should I care? I am not going to follow them because I’m using Twitter to talk with like-minded folks. If the “masses” want to join Twitter and follow Oprah, who are we to say that they shouldn’t?
If Oprah and other celebs have any impact on Twitter it will happen on a macro level. It will probably help to further the push to make Twitter mainstream (if it isn’t already). But I don’t think it will impact my experience on Twitter, or yours, or anybody else’s (with the exception of seeing the “whale” a few more times).
Chuck Hemann’s last blog post..If You’re Measuring Impressions You’re Missing The Point
@Mack. While I appreciate what you say, Mack, that wasn’t the point I was making re. Oprah (or anyone) at BlogWorld.
My point was that if the “everyday people” saw that Oprah, Ashton, Billy Bob Thornton or Big Bird from Sesame Street at an event that would normally put them off, wouldn’t it help raise awareness and add possible credence?
Let’s say, just for a minute, that people hear about something like “BlogWorld” or “Podcamp”. To the average Joe on the street, it’s geek talk. Events held by geeks for geeks.
(For the record, I’m not calling anyone connected with either event geeks ‘ just using an analogy).
Now, suddenly, Oprah Winfrey is attending. Ashton Kutcher is attending. Chuck Norris is attending.
Fans of these people may just want to check out what it’s all about, and join in. And as something gets larger, it (rightly or wrongly) tends to lend it some gravitas.
I’ve never said Oprah was being invited as an authority (has anyone from BlogWorld said that either?).
I merely said it could be a great way to get more people involved.
Anyone that doesn’t want this may just come across as wanting to keep the toys to themselves.
Which leaves social media exactly where it’s at – struggling to gain more mainstream and corporate understanding and acceptance.
Danny Brown’s last blog post..Lazy Sundays – SuzeMuse
“@Mack. While I appreciate what you say, Mack, that wasn’t the point I was making re. Oprah (or anyone) at BlogWorld.
My point was that if the “everyday people” saw that Oprah, Ashton, Billy Bob Thornton or Big Bird from Sesame Street at an event that would normally put them off, wouldn’t it help raise awareness and add possible credence?”
Yes and I agree with you completely on that point.
*My* point was that it’s a very dangerous slope we start down if we start offering celebrities the chance to keynote major social media conferences simply because they just joined Twitter. Or Facebook, or MySpace. Because then we aren’t offering them the chance to speak because of their expertise, but rather because of their status.
Now as I’ve said repeatedly, I think celebrities can be involved in a way that allows them to contribute as they can, and still makes sense.
But if it gets to the point where we are removing people like Amber Naslund or Geoff Livingston as speakers at a social media conference, to make way for Brad Pitt to speak on the same subject, then we’ve lost. Sure the ‘buzz’ factor for the event will go through the roof, but the VALUE of the event and the KNOWLEDGE that can be shared will go WAY down.
The bottom line is, who do WE identify as our leaders in this space? The people with the knowledge that comes from successfully using these tools for months/years, or the people that are celebrities.
I happily welcome celebrities using Twitter and other social media tools. But I’m not going to attend a conference to listen to a celeb that started blogging yesterday, tell me how to have a successful blog. I’ll listen to an expert if I want that information, not a celebrity.
Mack Collier’s last blog post..Better post titles work, and here’s the proof
[...] Another issue has been the disapproval of how celebrities are using social media. Some view Ashton’s race with CNN to 1 million followers as a publicity stunt that created a lot of buzz for himself and for twitter, and will be quickly forgotten. Oprah built up 40 thousand followers before even posting a tweet. In a community that values conversation and community, these are hardly the type practices that create real, valuable relationships. The issue is that many of these people are holding celebrities to the same accountability standards that we hold businesses on Twitter. While celebrities and business might seek similar benefits from social media, celebrities can’t (because of scale) and just don’t need to connect with their followers in the same way we expect businesses to. If you’re interested in reading more on this issue, there’s a great conversation going on at Beth Harte’s blog. [...]
@Mack. I guess we’ll have to agree to disagree, then, fella
Not everyone always just wants to hear the “experts” – they want to hear someone just like them as well, and if that means a newcomer to blogging and their experiences, that’s going to resonate far more than someone Joe Average doesn’t relate to.
Danny Brown’s last blog post..Lazy Sundays – SuzeMuse
Your original question was”Should celebs be held to the same level of accountability as businesses?”
The first answer is something you have blogged about before – personal branding – In this case her name is her brand, is her business. So if she is a business then yes you MUST use the same scrutiny – but then again anyone famous seems to be given a break whether here or anywhere else.
Rick Simmons’s last blog post..Fair Dinkum Tips – Facebook Fan Page
@Mack @Danny You both make very good points. It really matters on what BlogWorld’s goal with Keynote speakers is.
If they bring in keynote speakers to bring in some publicity and increase their popularity with new markets, then using Oprah as a keynote speaker is about as good as you can get.
As Danny said, bringing in a social media expert that is unknown out of the blogging community, will be practical if you’re aiming to educate and develop the current market, but will only be “geeks talking to geeks” and will not do much to increase popularity in markets.
I’m assuming they have keynote speakers for both goals (increase numbers and increase quality). There’s no reason they can’t have different speakers that focus specific goal.
If they’re looking for publicity, I guess they could have chosen a different celebrity that has more experience on twitter. When your goal is to increase numbers through celebrities though their value is based solely on numbers, not experience…and Oprah has the numbers.
David Spinks’s last blog post..The Mainstreamification of Twitter
Thanks for that David and yes and yes on both counts. We want to promote Blog World to the whole world, and yet make it beneficial for everyone.
In spite fo what may be thought, we tend not to give the nod to any speaker but beg and plead and hope that we can afford to have them.
I met with the executives of Blog World On Saturday for about 5 hours going over what we have so far. I have 11 separate tracks with many high powered people in each industry. We have all forms of new media, social being just a part of the overall. This is not a social media conference as has been suggested. It is much larger than that and we have to cater to many niches and genres.
I’m pretty sure it would take an act of God to get Oprah to even return a phone call let alone speak at Blog World and New Media Expo.
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@Everyone, I have to say, this is why I appreciate social media and blogging. I really like that I can share my thoughts and then everyone else feels comfortable enough to make it a larger discussion and a lively debate! Huge thanks to you all for taking this BlogWorld/Twitter/Oprah discussion to another level over the past few days.
I believe I owe you all an apology for combining two things here, which I think now clearly merit separation. There are two communities at play here in this conversation.
The first community is the Oprah community that might want to follow her on Twitter and could care less if she ever “talks back” or engages them. Heck, they probably don’t even care if she has a staff tweeting on her behalf. Oprah has a strong community on her website, so it would make sense this community might want to follow her on Twitter. From this regard, I am only asking this question: Should celebrities (which she is as well as a business owner) be held to the same standards that we expect from other businesses? If not, then let’s stop beating up and overanalyzing every misstep that businesses make when it comes to social media.
The second community at play here is the community that will (or consider) attending BlogWorld and their thoughts/feedback on Jim’s casual tweet about Oprah as a keynote speaker.
I agree, Twitter is just a tool and Ashton and Oprah have helped to make it a mainstream tool and that’s fine. It’s even better if “their” communities are excited about it.
I think where I have landed reading all these great comments is that there are bound to be exceptions made for some and not others. There are lots of communities who view social media tools and how to use those tools and not all the views are the same. So, if we agree that it’s okay for some companies to use social media for one-way push, it’s okay for some companies to not use it at all, and it’s okay for some companies to use social media to engage customers and that there are no rules for the ‘perfect’ way to use social media…then please stop beating up companies based on your own opinion of how social media should be implemented.
Was I beating up Oprah and her community? I hope not, that wasn’t my intention. I could care less that Oprah is on Twitter or using social media because I am not a part of her community. Was I questioning her as a potential BlogWorld keynote (as a member of that community), yes indeed, I was. Rick and Jim have allowed me the option to voice my opinion and I am grateful…now that is social media at work.
I think that Shaq should keynote BlogWorld just for this response to Oprah:
http://twitter.com/THE_REAL_SHAQ/status/1542241989
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I think that what’s interesting about this debate is that we once again seem to be defining social media by a set of tactics rather then outcomes. After all, she started her book clubs in 1996 and as posted on Wikipedia —
“In Reading with Oprah: The Book Club That Changed America, Kathleen Rooney describes Winfrey as “a serious American intellectual who pioneered the use of electronic media, specifically television and the Internet, to take reading—a decidedly non-technological and highly individual act—and highlight its social elements and uses in such a way to motivate millions of erstwhile non-readers to pick up books.”
I would say she’s been creating social media a lot longer then most of the SM experts we have today. It just wasn’t called social media back then. But, what do you call getting people together, both physically & through the internet, to discuss a topic or series of topics.
And, in 2008, she did the live, weekly webcasts with Elkhart Tolle and millions of people to create a social network around his book and teachings. Wasn’t that social media?
But now we’d suggest that because she’s late to the Twitter game, she doesn’t really know about SM. Well, that would be correct if SM was simply Twitter. But it’s not. Again, from Wikipedia:
Social media has become extremely popular because it allows people to connect in the online world to form relationships for personal and business.
As I said, Oprah started her book clubs in 1996, using the internet as a key tool to help people form relationships around the books. That would mean she’s been in the SM game for 13 years, right? Wouldn’t that qualify her as at least knowledgeable about SM?
In terms of the recent jump into Twitter by celebrities, I would think the real question is whether or not they’re authentic accounts. I don’t mean just that they’re not hijacked accounts, but whether or not that person is actually posting the tweets. What happens to the value of this communication tool when it’s done by ghostwriters instead of the real person? Isn’t that a better question for us to be discussing?
In terms of BlogWorld, I would think that she’s pretty well qualified to be a keynote speaker about the value of connecting people through new media.
David Polinchock’s last blog post..Heineken – Walk in Closet Commercial
@David Polinchock, First, I’d venture a guess that none of us care that Oprah is on Twitter. I have said that myself more than one. Second, I think most of the comments here referring to social media were in regards to it as an overall mindset/outcome versus tactics (i.e. Twitter).
The point of my blog post was that we are not holding celebrities up to the same social media “rules” that are being enforced on companies and I, personally, think that’s hypocritical.
What do I mean by the rules? Social media folks are constantly beating up and berating companies for not engaging in conversation. And when a Domino’s or Motrin situation erupts they dissect it and analyze it to death with the fault always falling on the company.
What you’ve described as what Oprah has done as social media (TV, the Internet and Webcasts) describes what a lot of companies have been doing for many years also. And sorry, I don’t consider the TV, Internet and webcasts to be social media.
Social media, according to Wikipedia is:
“… information content created by people using highly accessible and scalable publishing technologies. At its most basic sense, social media is a shift in how people discover, read and share news, information and content. It’s a fusion of sociology and technology, transforming monologue (one to many) into dialog (many to many) and is the democratization of information, transforming people from content readers into publishers. Social media has become extremely popular because it allows people to connect in the online world to form relationships for personal and business. Businesses also refer to social media as user-generated content (UGC) or consumer-generated media (CGM).”
As a media mogul, what has Oprah done to allow her viewers be a part of content generation or to have control in what shows, articles, etc. that Oprah produces?
Yes, there are communities on Oprah’s site, so I give her credit for that, but that’s people connecting with other people on her platform over a common interest. But Oprah herself is not engaged. So from that regard, she doesn’t represent social media at least for me personally. Is she using social media tools? Sure…for one way broadcasting and anyone can do that.
As for her Twitter account, I would suspect over time it won’t really be Oprah, but her staff tweeting…if they even keep it up. But again, she is not engaging, just broadcasting. I get the sense right now Oprah and her staff have ‘shiny object syndrome’ thanks to Mr. Kutcher.
[...] Harte says Celebs should be held to the same standard as Businesses who play in the blogosphere. I agree [...]